What type of plastic are you using on the stock?
On a separate note I design products that are know in the industry as thick wall molding (Nylon, Urethane and HDPE). My experience shows and I know you are far along now but when you think you have enough water lines add more!! Since this product most likely will not be high volume use I hope you used P20 steel for the cavity and aluminum for the core. You will enjoy a much better running mold with quicker cycle times. Hot tips? Interlocks?
Chances are you are running nylon (impact modified??) so you are very lucky as nylon runs very nice as compared to the fractional melt HDPE so some mistakes in mold building may me hidden.
Neat project and I bet it is a learning experience as it seems to be but I can't wait to see the final product and perhaps add on to my M4.
Any questions or words of wisdom I will be glad to help!!
Thank you, clubster.
We are using glass filled nylon. The glass composition is being tweaked as we assemble the components. For example, we are reducing the glass from the first article of our cheekpiece because the resulting part was so tough it was impossible to remove it from the stock once installed!
The tooling is made here in California and as far as I know is all steel.
Ahh! Since you are using glass filled nylon the P20 steel is the way to go as the glass will eat up a aluminum core.
Out of curiosity is your mold builder acting as the molder as well? Most of the time the mold builder just builds molds while molders just mold as they are two different trades.
Either way I will stop asking Q's but sometimes my real job comes out when it is play time looking for gun stuff.
Good luck and am looking forward to seeing the final product!
Mitch, I tried to order one through Brownells, but no luck yet. I don't think they will let anyone order until they have them in stock.
Do you have any status updates for us? Hopefully the final testing is going well!
Only one more full work week left in August. Are the M4 stocks here yet? Also, I was under the impression that these things were going to have adjustable LOP. Is that no longer the case?
Last edited by AggiePhil (2010-08-21 10:51:01)
It's not going to be this month. I will get the main stock by the end of this week. They we'll piece everything together.
We are having trouble with the cheekpiece, settling on a glass percentage. Will be more fiddling.
But hang in there.
Will the first batch be for 870's? I am hoping you will post pics installed on a shotgun in this forum as soon as they come in.
Unfortunately, the Remingtons will appear about three months after the Benellis, due to cash flow issues. Since we have been suffering from delays for the Benellis, this means the Remingtons won't ship until winter.
Edit from 16 Sept: In fact, the Remingtons will appear soon after the Benellis! :rockon:
Last edited by mitch (2010-09-16 08:04:24)
It is a Benelli stock after all.
Any update on delivery times for this? Really looking forward to this.
Sorry about going quiet last week. AT&T took a week to get our internet service transferred, despite our spending literally hours on various customer service lines trying to expedite the order. Great monopoly service.
Our moldmakers have fallen way behind. They said we should be able to see a stock armature last week, but it looks like it will be this week. I said we also need the grip sleeve at the same time. I tried to put a fire under them, but all you can do is plead. The fact is, they underestimated the complexity of the project.
Now that we are two months late I hope to see the armature (for the M4), grip sleeve and buttpad in the next two weeks (the buttplate is finished and we have a few Limbsaver versions). This will be for the version without a cheek riser. I think getting the cheek riser right will take a little extra time.
Thanks for sticking with this project Mitch!
The Urbino will be a great improvement over the Benelli OEM stock as well as adding a U.S. made part to help with compliance issues. You can tell a lot of us are looking forward to adding one of these to our M4s.
I'm holding out for the Cheek Riser/Limbsaver version! Please keep at it!!
The moldmaker just came in with the first shot of the M4 armature (the armature is what we call the main part of the stock assembly, the latter comprising the grip sleeve, buttplate and optional cheek riser in addition to the armature). He wanted to check for fit on the shotgun, and found a few areas that could use improvement. He took the shotgun with him and they will be working on fitment and such.
I don't get very dressed up here around the office. I spent a decade and a half in a suit, which I reckon is plenty.
For a first shot, this is a very nice piece. The moldmaker was excited and so am I. It is 30% glass filled nylon and is tough as hell. Even without texturing it looks and feels great. BTW, we are using the same moldmaker/injection house as SureFire.
I know most of you guys are champing at the bit for the Benelli versions, but this will also be by far the nicest tactical stock on the market for Remingtons, too.
I'd just like to say that despite all the delays and SNAFUs, this stock really is going to be huge for the entire shotgun community. I don't think that's any secret.
I myself am THIS close to buying my first Benelli shotgun and I just realized that it's apparently easier and cheaper to get the collapsible stock on a 14" M4 Entry than it is to get one on an 18.5" M4. WTF?? Where's the logic in that?? $500+ for a collapsible stock after the fact? I don't think so! So now I'm at the point where I'm either going to have to buy a too long to use fixed stock M4 and just sit on it or I'm going to have to put off the purchase altogether until the Urbino is out. Either way, I'm essentially in limbo until the Urbino is out. It's THAT important of a product for me and many others.
So Mitch...we're counting on ya.
Yesterday I spent some time at the moldmakers. We have been concerned about the cheek riser, since with the current mechanism it can't be removed if the material is stiff enough to ensure it doesn't deflect during use. This has been an issue for a month or so now.
We arrived a solution, however, by going back to our original proposal for a mechanism to secure the riser. This will require a minimum of changes to the existing tooling. And it will be a much more reliable set-up. Should have stayed with it from the beginning.
Here are some close-up pics of the first articles. Note that they have not been textured yet.
Mitch, in light of the latest developments in regards to the cheek riser, are you still thinking that the cheek riser models are going to be even more delayed than the non-cheek riser models? I'll be waiting on the cheek riser model since I'll be putting an Aimpoint Micro on my M4.
Nice job Mitch. Looking forward to getting a tan one with the limb saver and the cheek rest. And 2 black ones with a limb saver only.
You still attaching the QD points above the pistol grip?
Massive improvement since we saw it at SHOT.
Yes, whatever happens the cheek riser models will take longer as we have to make changes to the molds for the cheek riser, the rail inserts for the armature and the buttplate.
However, the buttplate changes could delay the entire project, so that everything becomes available at once.
We will not be embedding the push-button sling swivel cups as in the earliest prototypes. All the police officers who tried the prototypes hated them.
Instead, we have devised a pocket push button sling swivel receptacle that will optionally fit between the receiver and stock.
BTW, we are not having any luck getting a sample of the coyote color for color matching. Is there a coated piece of your shotgun, like the forend, you could loan us to get a color match?
I wouldn't copy the factory tan. It looks like crap. The best way would be to copy the magpul FDE. You could easily get a set of those.
I'd buy a OD green one if it was available. It would match the newer M4 receiver.
We'll check out the Magpul coyote color.
Meanwhile, the brackets for the Urbino-mount SureShells were just completed. They are machined from an aluminum extrusion that hugs the side of the cheekpiece. We are sending them out to the anodizers today.
In this pic you can see the bracket for the six-shot version. Note that this is on an early prototype Urbino stock, mounted on a Benelli SuperNova, with an early first article of the cheekpiece, untextured. So the only thing right in this photo is the SureShell, and of course it's not yet anodized.
I would definitely match Magpul's Flat Dark Earth (FDE) as that's what most accessory makers have gone to. They make all kinds of things in it. Make MY Urbino in any color though, as long as it's black.